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Talk:Irelia/@comment-86.82.178.97-20120412230750/@comment-4957501-20120416151300
You have a team to back you up, I never discounted that, but being an AP burst assassin with that build you're already going to be a high priority target and on top of that you'll be squishier than a Soraka because atleast the Soraka will have items like Aegis, Shurleya's possibly a Randuin's and multiple heals on top of that while you have no defense whatsoever, literally in the middle of the enemy team. Like I said, even with 40% reduced duration of CC a single CC is still going to give them much more time than they need when their carry, bruiser and AP mid burst you from full to 0 in 2 seconds flat...... 2 seconds being generous. Yes, that's your job, but easier said than done isn't it? If bursting the carry down were simply as easy as you say it is, assassins would be the new meta and in every game of every tournament. When was the last time you saw a Talon in a tournament game? And mind you, Talon is a proper assassin, capable of silencing, amplifying and dealing instantaneous damage and also has an escape mechanism. Make no mistake, carries are always very well protected, and unless you're playing at 800 elo, people aren't stupid enough to simply continue stacking PD's on their carries all game and will actually get a couple of defensive items. With the support standing right next to them and multiple CC's in their team, pray tell me what exactly are your chances of managing to burst the carry down against a half decent team, even after your teams initiated already? Most melee mages have the same job as ranged mages do, go for the squishies if you can, the thing is it's more easily said than done to get to the squishies unless you managed to ambush them, in which case any regular AP mid or bruiser could do the job of taking the carry out with each others help. If you're building Sion AP, I fail to see how 800 damage is "minor". Late game, 800 is half the HP of most AP mages. And how does he not have teamfight sustain? His ultimate not only heals him for an incredible amount even without building AD but allies around him too. His shield and stun are as spammable as your ES. With Akali, again, you say burst the squishy like the entire enemy teams not going to work to shut you down the moment you look at the most important member of their team late game wrong. Moving on, your TB isn't going to make sure you survive until the end of the fight. You're going to have to survive getting all 4 of your TB's off, which, as you jumped into the enemy team a couple of seconds ago and used your ES along with the delay between casts, leaves you wide open for being CC'd, which is something you dont seem to be getting. CC'd = no casting anything. Even if it wasn't hard CC and just a snare or slow and you can cast stuff, theres no guarantee youre going to not get bursted down the 2 seconds it's going to take you cast all four TB's. And EVEN if you do hit all 4 TB's like I said, hitting multiple people with them is incredibly tough unless the enemy teams standing in a line for your benefit, and all 4 TB's on a single champion are going to get you back the incredible amount of around 410 HP with 500 AP. Your argument of the carry out DPS-ing you late game is pointless, if bruiser's could outdamage the carry both early, mid and late game, why would carries be played at all? Irelia doesn't get out DPS-ed by every other Trinity tank out there late game either, I don't know where you got that information from. Irelia has a weaker later game than most other bruisers yes, but she has an extremely powerful mid game to make up for it. Every hero has their up's and down's. Saying "so and so is weaker than every other hero in their class out there in every situation" is stupid. And here's how you fight a Shen with a thornmail - you don't. You go for everyone else first because Shen is just going to be a nuisance with his taunting and his sub-par damage, you don't go for the tank with the thornmail first, I don't have to tell you why and he's definitely not going to out dps you unless you're a terrible Irelia. He might outlane you in the beginning because of your naturally weak early and his no manacost harass, but lategame with full items you have no excuse to lose. Especially considering Irelia excels at shredding tanks, like you stated earlier. Shen's been everywhere this free week, and I haven't lost a solotop game to one even once. I lost my lane sometimes, I won't deny that, but I never lost the game in the end. You seem to have a weird concept of what a bruiser actually does. Just to clear things up, a bruiser is someone who won't be able to deal the pure damage a carry will be able to late game, but he has durability and CC, making them a high priority target because ignored they will stomp your team into the ground, but if you focus them, they can withstand the punishment for more than a few seconds and their carry is wreaking havoc the entire time. They also usually have strong laning phases and always have strong mid games. Think of them like the bastard child of the tank and the carry. A bruiser will NOT be able to 1vs1 a carry with full items late game. Ever. So the rest of your argument is kind of invalid. See, I'm glad the build worked for you, it's just that for 99% of the people who try it it's not going to work at all. This build is simply unviable in ranked, it's as simple as that. It's like playing AD LeBlanc, sure Siv HD might have won a few games on his stream with it, doesn't mean it'll actually work in most games hmm?